Hello all,
So i am in a canundrum. I am going to buy a new car (EV) and of course want to buy something from which the EU benefits. I am considering the Skoda Enyaq and the Cupra Tavascan. Both car brands are part of the VW group, which is a European company. However, I found out that the Cupra is built is Hefei, China, while the Skoda is built in Czechia which is of course in europe. The Cupra is in fact more equipped than the Skoda while also being cheaper. This may of course in part be explained by where they are built. How do you guys feel about this?
Thanks for your insights in advance!
The skoda is assembled in Czechia, but the parts come from all over the place including china. You won’t find a fully european car.
Honestly I’d go with whatever car suits you the most.
Though I wanna urge you to reconsider choosing an suv and go with something eco-friendly instead
Thank you for your answer. I agree with you, getting the parts is done from all over the world. But it does mean that a larger part of the money I pay stays in the EU right?
With regards to the comment on the SUV. I cannot disagree with you. The weight of most cars is a large issue. In terms if performance I don’t think specifically the Skoda under performs much compared to for example the VW ID.7 which is more of a station wagon. Do you have any suggestions with regards to a more lightweight car, with at least ~70kwh capacity from a European brand?
I don’t think you’ll find anything significantly lighter @ 70kwh, i4 comes to mind but its only like 100kg lighter. i3 with a 70 battery is about 130kg lighter
Is the Skoda Enyaq an SUV though? I kind of had in my head it was an estate
Some people need the space if they don’t live in a city and have lots of children or dogs or tools and then an electric SUV is much better than a ICE van or truck.
Especially if that home had terrible bus and train connections because of the decades long fight of the country’s right wing party to defund and dismantle the public transportation network in order to privatize it for their corporate interests.
Then get yourself an electric wagon, and if you really want the space - a minivan or a van. There isn’t a single case where an SUV would be the most adequate option.
The only electric wagon with serious battery capacity is the Taycan lol, at least until bmw and audi offerings come to dealerships. So, you’ll be paying for (mostly) unnecessary luxury and thus weight.
I hope PSA come out with something cool but I’m not holding my breath, afaik they’re still at 54kw, though efficiency is better than their old stuff.edit: op wants 70+, that’s why I’m looking at higher capacity, I know not everybody needs it
I don’t mind myself a little bit of Porsche but in terms of the wagon vs SUV discussion. The Porsche has an average milage of 167 wh/km while the enyaq coupe base a milage of 168 wh/km. This difference is insignificant if you ask me. Furthermore the Porsche weighs 2165 kg while the enyaq weighs 2140 kg. So the enyaq is actually lighter! (All data from EV database).
So the fact that the enyaq is an SUV doesn’t seem to matter here?
I wasn’t really suggesting the taycan, luxury cars are heavy by default, and the whole car (while beautiful) isn’t making good use of it’s interior. Not exactly a family car. Just saying that so far it’s the only euro wagon with 70+ batteries.
rambling about comparisons
Comparing bodystyles would be more interesting if both cars were roughly in the same segment (like Astra wagon vs Mokka e vs Combo e) and the same ev evolution branches.
Taycan wagon is bigger in every dimension except height, has a bigger battery in most trims, and weight (for 21-24 models according to arenaev) is 2245 kg unladen, 2885 kg gross. Also if I remember right, it’s built on an ICE-derived platform taken from the Panamera. Enyaq is built on a platform designed specifically for EVs since day one. And funnily enough it’s got abetter drag coefficient than porsche.
By the way efficiency is very different on this database, they use WLTP and taycan is slightly ahead. Weight is very much trim-dependent, but even a 77kWh enyaq 80 is lighter at 2090kg unladen. If you want the heaviest enyaq RS, that’ll be almost 2260 kg.
TLDR: affordable midsize suv on an ev platform is most likely better at being an EV than a luxury executive wagon built on an ice (derived) platform
Frankly, if we’re talking EV, then it’s really hard to point out on actually eco-friendly vehicle. It’s just a no-no with their absurd weight and how their battery production hurts the planet.
Hello thank you for tour commentaar, But i dont think this is entirely true. Looking on the internet I find many sources like this one:
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/09/1250212212/ev-batteries-environmental-impact
It is stated here that EVs are indeed worse for the environment when being built, however in the long term they catch up to petrol cars and when disposed off have a net positive effect.
Yes it is true that the car size is a problem. But this is also true for large and heavy combustion engine cars. So as this article also states: it would be best to buy a small EV with limited battery capacity to reduce environmental impact. That being said: I am going to buy a larger one so your argument is at least more true in my case.
Additionally I do think electric cars are the future. But maybe not with Li-ion batteries. We need lighter and more energy dense alternatives which are currently not (yet) available. By investing in our electrical infrastructure now and adopting electric cars now, even though they are only marginally better than combustion engine cars, we are moving to a greener future. By sticking with combustion engine cars, there is only a dead end in 50 something years even if we would ignore climate change.
Also before someone brings up hydrogen cars: hydrogen has its own challenges and H2 cars are in fact also electric cars with electric motors. So hydrogen which is lagging behind in battery development may also profit from the development of EVs. Personnaly I think hydrogen will not become very interesting for consumer cars, but rather for trucks, boats and other heavy duty vehicles.
I end up having this discussion with my brother alot, whether an EV is environmental friendly or not.
Our conclusion each time is that no consumption is, but if you need a car to exist then an EV is the best option. That and the truly environmentally friendly option would be to kill ourselves immediately :)
Exactly, this is my problem. And getting a car with less range is not really am option as I want to use the car for going on holidays etc. I could also keep my petrol car and get something light and aerodynamic with less kwhs for daily use. But having two cars is financially unattractive and my petrol car is relatively small. This way I end up with two cars with insufficient boot space for my family to go on holiday for example.
Look into used Priuses. They start they mature phase after 150000km… Edit: my bad. Wrong sub. I’ll see myself to the door
Did you see the new Prius design? Dear god it looks fast almost like a bugatti. Hats of to Toyota for making the nerd mobile sexy !
Yeah, way out of my league though. I’ll stick to my 08 Prius lI
I’m listening. Do you have any specific recommendations? As I mentioned the wagons I know off with similar specs don’t rally have any significant advantages in terms of kWh/km or weight. Only Tesla has a real edge here and not buying Tesla is one of the reasons for this community to exist right?
Is it being electric a must? I can give you a handful of great options if you’re also into ICE cars
with something eco-friendly
The Enyaq is absolutely about as eco friendly as it gets. It’s very energy efficient and has good aerodynamics.
We can’t all drive around in stupid Fiat 500 cars that suck balls because they are from Stellantis.As eco friendly as it gets? A vehicle that weighs at least 2 tons, which also want to be decelerated from time to time? Come on man.
About as eco friendly as it gets. Very important detail, I never claimed it was best. But the difference to a sedan is negligeable.
I understand it’s counterintuitive, but Yes actually!
https://youtu.be/YMLQrEaped8?t=2016Notice it’s more efficient than the Ioniq 5 !!! And also than the BMW i4 which is a sport sedan.
https://youtu.be/EYLQzWnALE4?t=886
This is the older iV80 in the SUV version, slightly less efficient than the newer one, but still doing pretty well.
Obviously it’s not the absolute best because of the weight, but it’s not nearly as bad as you probably thought.
It’s almost identical to the ID3 which is not an SUV.VW did an amazing job with the MEB platform, and Skoda did an amzing job with the design of the Enyaq, so it’s better than the VW ID4.
You could also get some solar panels, and 200 or 225 Wh/km becomes near irrelevant.Electric cars are notoriously heavy, that’s not unique for Enyaq. A Sedan is heavy too. To be significantly more efficient than the Enyaq, you have to go way down in size INCLUDING battery size! Which makes it a much less versatile car.
My Fiat 500 comment wasn’t either a joke or sarcasm, that’s how far you need to downgrade before it makes a significant difference. For me an electric Fiat 500 would be completely useless. For instance I need to be able to pull a trailer.
VW did really get “the car part” right, but man… my colleague bought Skoda and he’s more and more frustrated from the app and cars quirky systems. Just today the car refused to turn heating on, not remotely, not even when he was in car. The only option was to reset infotainment to factory settings. But then parking sensors stopped working… You can do bare minimum through the app remotely. Not counting that the app more often does NOT work at all rather than it does. “Car unreachable” etc. even when his phone and car are at the same wifi at home…
That’s weird, most comments I’ve heard it should be very reliable?
But I’ve only been looking at the Enyaq. Are we talking about the same car?Edit PS: I think it doesn’t have over the air updates, maybe it’s a bad (early) version, and he should have an upgrade from the shop?
He has Octavia PHEV, which should have virtually the same system as early Enyaqs… And it’s really PITA, so much so, he’s about to sell it and buy Tesla, even though Elon is such a prick.
he’s about to sell it and buy Tesla,
🤣 🤣 🤣
which should have virtually the same system as early Enyaqs
No I don’t think so, Octavia is not the MEB platform, but probably based on an older software design.
I can see here the Octavia PHEV was never popular, despite the Octavia used to be. but the PHEV sales numbers are extremely low, and apparently was only available for a couple of years. The sales were only 1.6% of the Enyaq!I’ve seen many reviews and read fora about Enyaq, and I’ve never heard about anything like you describe. On the contrary I’ve often heard it described as very reliable, and for VW group as a whole a huge step up from previous models. The Octavia PHEV is admittedly not previous but contemporary, but maybe the software is different IDK.
According to the Skoda homepage the current Skoda Octavia software version is (O3A4) SW1985, but only ICE is listed, For Enyaq it’s ME3.8.
So no I do not think it’s the same software, and your friend should probably check if an update is available.
Skoda Elroq is an amazing EV.
Thanks for your advice. The enyaq is the same car, just 18 cms longer.I think we will choose this one in the end.
both Skoda are great, can’t go wrong. just depends on how big you need for strength to haul.
I don’t need to tow anything. Just a big boot for the stroller and all the baby stuff.
then def recommend the Elroq. It’s also our choice for our next car, and we’re a small family.
This is why I feel china will win in the end.
The vast majority will look for price / performance ratios, and your example is a perfect one.
Good luck in choosing.
The recent Smarter Every Day video on trying to build a “simple” product in the US was quite revealing. Avoiding China produced parts is close to impossible. Not only that, high skill jobs such as tooling design have been outsourced too, so the idea that China is just running the machines is outdated.
All these companies have pumped billions every year into China and are now surprised they can’t compete.
Thanks for your comment. I think we will eventually choose the Skoda. The design of the tavascan is a bit too much for a family car anyways.
They own the means of production
If you need a trailer at some point, the Enyaq can pull a trailer up to 1000 kg, while the Tavascan can’t at all.
Regarding environment, the Enyaq is very efficient and aerodynamic despite the size.
Thanks you for your advice!
