Do the army support the president even if his orders are against your constitution? How is the overll clima and feeling today?
Just asking because I’m curious, I have no horse in this race :)
Edited to Armed forces since thats exactly what I ment
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none of my friends in the armed forces are smart or socially conscious people. they are not at all curious about any of life’s questions.
I have no horse in this race :)
The fascist armed forces do and they have them trample on protesters.
Normally they just terrorise brown people, also nice that they don’t have to take a plane to do that now.
Let’s face it, who do you think elected the Mr. President?
Musk’s voting machines?
The 9-10 million people who voted for Biden in 2000 and didn’t bother voting in 2024.
white boomers, incels, religious fundamentalists and petty tyrants?
As a leftwing incel I find that offensive, the right wing incels give us a bad name
I’ll bite, in what way are left wing incels different? Genuinely curious because I’ve never heard incels split into right vs left before.
I mean an incel is just some one who’s involuntarily celibate, it wasn’t a political thing it used to just be a bunch of awkward guys on the net the BS politics and the insane misogyny all came later.
What’s even funnier is that often being a „good feminist“ can literally lead you to getting no pussy which often drives these people into even more misogyny. I have extreme anxiety talking to people I find attractive and have a very hard time reading people’s body language as to when they’re sexually interested, the only time I’ve ever managed to pick up a random person has been basically when I acted like a pick up artist. It sucks and I hate it but in cis dating (at least where i live) basically all the responsibility is put on the man and it fucking sucks.
The right wing incels don’t get a pass for their shitty politics but being starved of intimacy as an adult human is a form of torture imo and it fucking sucks. Not that men or any person has a right to other people’s bodies but I’m pretty sure if you deprived a bunch of men of any form of sexual intimacy 99% of them would go fucking insane. There is a reason why celibacy was considered a spiritual practice or sacrifice for humans it’s not an easy thing to do or be.
Right wing incel is playing video games and acting shitty to women gamers
Don’t forget the overwhelming general apathy towards, and lack of participation in, politics the majority has.
well yeah, if we were organized in collectives and unions to actually push for better policy, it wouldn’t be as much of a problem.
These boots taste great.
I am recently (last few weeks recent) out of the Navy. Not eoas but I doubt people are interested in the reasons and it would be easy to dox me if I got into details.
Its bad. Most of the people in the navy are more than willing to do whatever they are told. I was a role that had a higher than average level of people leaning left and even then most of them were explicitly republican even if they thought trump was stupid.
The military will just do whatever they are told unless someone higher up is willing to break ranks first.
So it’s like every other big institution gotcha 😉
I know you’re kidding but I hope people aren’t excited about “showing those savages who are boss” at the nees that were bombing people.
Im not really kidding in most big organisations people just do what they’re told, being the hero fucking sucks and will ruin your life that’s why most people just keep their heads down and focus on their own and families survival.
“War criminals of lemmy, what do you and your fellow pond scum think about potentially shooting white people for a change?”
Pond scum is an extremely productive microecosystem. I won’t stand for you insulting it by comparing US soldiers to it.
Additionally, gonna hazard a guess that the majority of the protesters aren’t white or at least wouldn’t be considered white by the soldiers regardless of their skin tone. They’re literally protesting white supremacist actions by the government.
😂
They’ve never had any problems with any of the other crimes against humanity they were ordered to do so why start now? They literally think they should be hailed as gods in the US and anyone who doesn’t is a traitor, you think they’d have any qualms about killing protestors when they’ve already been told that they’re anti-US terrorist scum?
It’s literally the exact same tactics the IDF uses. Wonder who Israel learned it from.
Have you talked to anyone in the armed forces? Many of them are there because they grew up poor and in the U.S. joining the military can be a good way to get out of poverty.
Only a tiny fraction actually do any combat and even fewer commit war crimes. The main ones committing “war crimes” is Congress who does things like give weapons to Israel.
I volunteered for the Army on my birthday They draft the white trash first around here anyway
The majority of gang members also grew up poor and joined a gang to get out of poverty. Does that make it justified?
Yankistanis always have talking points that deflect their own wrongdoings but does not apply to others in similar scenario.
People inside rn be like: “Why are some of these people I’m shooting white??.. Ah well.”
If you honestly think they have an issue with following illegal orders, I think you should take a look at The Kent State massacre
The military has done some horrible stuff but going back 50+ years to prove how they feel today seems a stretch.
Even if it was over 50 years ago it was a significant point in history that a lot of people seem to forget, and was a major turning point for the public during Vietnam. It’s also relevant to today with what’s happening.
Most of the US military have zero qualms about obeying illegal orders.
Reference: Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam, and most other U.S. instigated wars for their entire history.
This is what has been most depressing/distressing about watching all of this unfold. People online (and I’m not immune to this either) have this impulse to think “Surely not right? Surely these people will come to their senses and not just blindly follow transparently evil orders right? We’ve been told these people are heroes who stand up for freedom and democracy and our safety right? Surely at least some of them will do the right thing right?” It’s so ingrained into us through support our troops propaganda and various TV/Movies showing them and cops as principled heroes saving the day. We’ve also seen this with corporations. “Wow I can’t believe this company turned away from DEI so quickly. I can’t believe this company is going to keep selling surveillance tech to the government. Surely someone will see how wrong that is.”
And then I snap back to my senses and remember history. We’ve seen what horrors these people are willing to commit, whether they want to or are “just following orders.” Maybe you at least believe that they won’t do it to US, as cynical as that is… and then you remember Kent State, segregation, the violent crackdown on unions, the police rallying around protecting cops who execute people in the streets, etc.
Nobody is going to come to their senses. None of them are coming to save us from themselves. If we don’t stand up for ourselves this is just going to happen and be another chapter in a long history of cruelty.
The thing is that it becomes different when the order becomes “go to your home town, shoot anyone who disobeys, including your friends and family.”
It might take a decade of brutal civil war, but look what happened in Syria. In the end the people in the army were also tired of murdering their own people.
The solution here is even easier than the division they’ve already been sowing upon the American people.
You don’t send them home. You send them to the place that is the most culturally disparate from the way they grew up possible. You’re a New England liberal? Great. We’ll post you in the center of conservative Texas. Red Cap from a family of Diehard conservatives? You go to Oregon. New York inner city youth? You get special duty, guarding critical corporate infrastructure.
Keep them divided, keep them guessing. All it takes for control of a human being.
The Milgram experiment. The Zimbardo prison experiment. The bystander effect. At the end of the day, humans are just monkeys with smart watches. As social primates, it’s really hard to be the one to stand up against the crowd. Our brains decide how to act based largely on the reactions of other humans around us.
It’s disheartening.
Don’t use the Zimbardo prison experiment. From your link:
Certain critics have described the study as unscientific and fraudulent.[6][7] In particular, Thibault Le Texier has established that the guards were asked directly to behave in certain ways in order to confirm Zimbardo’s conclusions, which were largely written in advance of the experiment.
I’m going to repeat what @plyth said. “Don’t use the Zimbardo prison experiment”.
Zimbardo was as manipulative as the psychologists from the Robbers Cave experiment,
with the only difference being that the former was only done once, while in the latter,
the subjects figured out that they were being manipulated and turned against the psychologists.Because of this, the conclusions Zimbardo drew himself are very different from when you conclude that
Zimbardo was behind the whole ordeal pulling the strings.
One only needed to stand up against one person, not a crowd.
Military operative have been trained to obey like dogs, their sentience has been mercilessly beaten out if them. Just look at the mindless obedience of your coworkers, sheeps to the slaughter the lot of them. The few that awaken gets co-opted by the system as sheep dogs of the system are rewarded with meaty, juicy bones. Questionning authority is not an option, it’s a sin. They know their masters would never punish their obedience, it would never happen, it NEVER happens.
The military is a corrupt and vile institution, it is irrelevant who they are killing for, they are not on “your” side, they are trying to survive and will kill what they are told. All who participate in organized premeditated militarism as a job, while not under immediate attack of another organized and premeditated military, are simply lost to humanity, they have become the enemy, tools, no matter what flag they jack into at night. In hyperwar militaries are obsolete because they become incoherent, there is no enemy if cannot point to it. The enemy is you.
Of course they do, they also want to keep some sanity or, you know, keep breathing.
I’m certainly not getting my hopes up, but this being in LA instead of Kabul might have a significant effect on how willingly the rank-and-file will just open up on a crowd.
There’s a big Navy base in San Diego; some of the Marines are probably coming from there. Some probably grew up in California, more probably visited LA at some point. Going a few hours to a place where people speak your language and there is an In-and-Out Burger down the street is very different from going halfway across the world to a place where you recognize little and understand far less.
Honestly it depends people have become pretty divided, I’m sure there are enough freaks in the Maga media cult that no longer see their fellow citizens as humans but just as a part of the woke mob. The direct and logical conclusion of the culture war was always an actual fucking war.
You might want to edit your post to read “armed forces” rather than army. The United States armed forces include Army, Navy, Coast Guard, Marines, Air Force, Space Force (LOL), and the National Guard. I apologize if I left anyone out.
The National Guard is not monolithic either, as it is per service and per state. I.e. Minnesota Air National Guard, Minnesota Army National Guard, Iowa Air… you get it
To clarify the army has 3 types active, national guard and reserve
The reserve doesn’t have combat mos and are primarily support. Active duty soldiers live on bases when not deployed, and train throughout the week like a regular job. The national guard is still part of the army, they train for the same jobs at the same place and wear the exact same uniform. All three departments wear a name tape that says U.S. army.
They just so happen to be in their respective states service, and can be acted on by the governor as well. National guard also does disaster relief when state side. All three departments can be deployed to a conflict internationally.
You are right that is what I ment! Just edited
I’d like to know if there is are general differences between the branches. Like, is the Air Force more liberal?
There are differences but I wouldn’t use terms like “liberal” although those who chose to join the Marines due tend to have a particular stereotype.
Something something crayons right?
That’s a special dietary need.
There are differences, but it’s quite difficult to define. There’s not a huge political difference except maybe the Marines are stereotypically known to be more right-leaning.
Are they allowed on Lemmy? Partially sarcastic
Yeah, since it’s “peace time” and less risk there’s probably a decent chunk of the armed forces who are just in it for the perks ( free college, Healthcare) and don’t believe in it and are trying to serve there time and get out and not make a career of it.
They aren’t cops who almost always want to be cops and make it a core part of their identity and belief system. They aren’t allowed on lemmy.
As individuals yes, as representatives of the armed forces? Not likely. Anonymity helps, but I’m sure many would be wary of posting anything contrarian views right now.
Lemmy isn’t anonymous, it’s pseudonomyous.
Depends on what a person posts, but yes I’ll give you that. I can’t see it being anonymous from the government if they wanted to find out someone’s identity.
and even then, finding out can simply be a matter of knowing who subscribes to that ip. on some places all they have to do is ask the admin nicely.
i’m surprised theres no public tool to extrapolate someones identity for the lemmy posting history just yet, like there is for reddit.
Is anybody not allowed on Lemmy? It’s a federated platform
Anyone who answers this question is doing so at risk to their career. I hope they do either way.
we would have to get too many chuds in.
but maybe if we put effort into creating some warthunder forum accounts…
Yeah I know. But I’m curious to know if they support the president even if he decides for a coup. Just curious not american
Some definitely do. The majority may not support it on its face, but will follow orders to a far point.
